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Sbaker34
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« on: January 26, 2012, 05:55:39 PM » |
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Say you take a guy with moderate training. Then double his bench press, deadlift, and squat, how much harder would he be able to punch?
I am kind of curious assuming you have some general idea how to throw a straight punch, eg core and legs and so forth. Would increasing my strength yield more power? Or do most heavy weight boxers just hit harder due to more weight, and extreme training?
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concuncon
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2012, 06:13:47 PM » |
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I think bench press doesn't do anything for punching power. Squat and deadlift does to a great degree. Since remember punching is not about pushing force, but the transferring of leg power to the arm - so there's 2 things: leg power, core strength. Squat and deadlift do just that. But of course just as squat and deadlift strong doesn't mean you can clean or snatch big, a punch is also a skill that need a lot of practice just to reach the maximum use of the strength you have. One person can just practice punching and have a super punch without lower body strength training, but that's his limit, while another person who practice punching + lower body strength training will definitely have more room to progress.
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Polished
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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2012, 07:00:05 PM » |
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I think bench press doesn't do anything for punching power. Squat and deadlift does to a great degree. Since remember punching is not about pushing force, but the transferring of leg power to the arm
That's where powerlifting bench press comes in. If you've ever set up to push your 3RM with a powerlifting set-up, you'll feel your entire body working in coordination. Punching power is more about a strong core and good hip rotation. |
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Goals: Squat 365 ATG (315 3x3 Current) Deadlift 455 425x3Bench 275 1RM 245x3Check out my progress diary if you'd like =)
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Sbaker34
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« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2012, 07:00:40 PM » |
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I think bench press doesn't do anything for punching power. Squat and deadlift does to a great degree. Since remember punching is not about pushing force, but the transferring of leg power to the arm
That's where powerlifting bench press comes in. If you've ever set up to push your 3RM with a powerlifting set-up, you'll feel your entire body working in coordination. Punching power is more about a strong core and good hip rotation. But regardless of which particular lift contributes the most, strength does matter? |
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AustinG1994
Austin
Bulking Gnome
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A plan has no meaning until it's put into action
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« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2012, 08:03:43 PM » |
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I think punching power would come from how fast you can swing a punch, and how much weight is behind that punch. You don't necessarily need arm strength to increase the weight behind your punch, but since stronger people are generally heavier, the heavier you are.. usually the harder you can punch. People who are "knockout artists" thank their speed more than their strength. Speed is more important than strength when it comes to punching power.
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T-Rex
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« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2012, 09:03:05 PM » |
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Hand Speed and Torque generated by rotation of the Hips and Leg Drive!
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Mexicutioner
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« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2012, 09:25:54 PM » |
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Hand Speed and Torque generated by rotation of the Hips and Leg Drive!
100% Correct!! Source: Amateur Boxing (never made it to the big leagues *sob*) |
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MercNil
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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2012, 07:12:17 AM » |
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Yes if it's speed strength because you must hit the target to effectively effectuate the blow. Speed x mass equals force. :3
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danielvam
Regular Gnome
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Its great to be alive
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« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2012, 09:52:06 AM » |
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I've practiced karate for a long time and IMO the most important thing for pushing is technic!!. As concuncon said most of the power of a puch comes from your legs, not your arms or shoulders or chest for that matter. Have you seen those guys who break concrete block with a punch? It is all about technic. Lifting weight will give you a bit of an edge but the main thing is how you deliver the power of the punch. But regardless of which particular lift contributes the most, strength does matter?
I will say that strenght is 10% of the punch, speed 10%, other 80% is technic  |
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"Be like water my friend" - Bruce Lee
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Sbaker34
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« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2012, 10:24:23 AM » |
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I've practiced karate for a long time and IMO the most important thing for pushing is technic!!. As concuncon said most of the power of a puch comes from your legs, not your arms or shoulders or chest for that matter. Have you seen those guys who break concrete block with a punch? It is all about technic. Lifting weight will give you a bit of an edge but the main thing is how you deliver the power of the punch. But regardless of which particular lift contributes the most, strength does matter?
I will say that strenght is 10% of the punch, speed 10%, other 80% is technic So, for example, a non weight training woman could hit 80% as hard as your average heavy weight boxer assuming she trained technique a lot? I know it matters a lot, but I find it hard to believe. Also why are 70% of the answers simply saying bench press doesn't matter? Perhaps not with proper technique, but I can still punch using triecps, shoulder and chest alone, not as hard obviously, but those muscles are still used, if upper body strength didn't matter ANY, I doubt fighters would train upper body. |
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MercNil
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« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2012, 10:43:58 AM » |
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I've practiced karate for a long time and IMO the most important thing for pushing is technic!!. As concuncon said most of the power of a puch comes from your legs, not your arms or shoulders or chest for that matter. Have you seen those guys who break concrete block with a punch? It is all about technic. Lifting weight will give you a bit of an edge but the main thing is how you deliver the power of the punch. But regardless of which particular lift contributes the most, strength does matter?
I will say that strenght is 10% of the punch, speed 10%, other 80% is technic So, for example, a non weight training woman could hit 80% as hard as your average heavy weight boxer assuming she trained technique a lot? I know it matters a lot, but I find it hard to believe. Also why are 70% of the answers simply saying bench press doesn't matter? Perhaps not with proper technique, but I can still punch using triecps, shoulder and chest alone, not as hard obviously, but those muscles are still used, if upper body strength didn't matter ANY, I doubt fighters would train upper body. Bench press does matter, but not for punching technique purpose. It may serve to strengthen the upper body in it's own way, however, when it comes to functionality, I agree with glenn pendlay, it's all in the push press. :3 The idea is, to do general fitness to strengthen the body as a whole, like doing bench press - strength exercises, conditioning etc. Then after having done so, to work on technique.  Both can be done exclusively of each other. |
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King Neptune
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« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2012, 11:15:33 AM » |
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Punching power comes from the hips. You also need a strong core and strong lats to transfer the force efficiently. Delts, triceps, and pecs only contribute a small fraction of the force. Bench press can be used to build those, but it doesn't do anything for hip rotation, and learning to transfer the power in this specific way. Also, it is about rate of force development, not about brute force.
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MercNil
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« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2012, 11:19:35 AM » |
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Therefore, my suggestion to do weight training separately with technique training. |
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King Neptune
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« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2012, 11:31:46 AM » |
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You could use the bench press when you want to put on mass (but even then, it wouldn't be necessary), but it doesn't do anything in and of itself for punching power. And you have to keep your scaps pinned to the bench during the bench press, which basically teaches you not to use the serratus anterior, the "boxer muscle". In short, a fighter is probably better off without the bench press.
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MercNil
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« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2012, 11:36:36 AM » |
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You could use the bench press when you want to put on mass (but even then, it wouldn't be necessary), but it doesn't do anything in and of itself for punching power. And you have to keep your scaps pinned to the bench during the bench press, which basically teaches you not to use the serratus anterior, the "boxer muscle". In short, a fighter is probably better off without the bench press.
You miss the point. You can train to get stronger by lifting weights which are not necessarily related to the exercise you're doing, and then do a separate workout not for lifting but for punching. |
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